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81 thoughts on “Patron Preview: Spelljammer in Eberron”
Under your current vision, how would you implement the remnants of the moon Crya, which might be valuable to anyone with a stake in Dal Quor? What about Atropus, from 3.5 Elder Evils? What about removing the canonical 3.5 Elder Evils suggestion for Atropus in Eberron, and making Atropus an undead Crya?
Under your current vision, how would you implement the remnants of the moon Crya…
In MY vision, you won’t find pieces of Crya in orbit. Exploring Eberron notes “In those regions of il-Lashtavar that appear to be outdoors, adventurers may notice a dark, nearly invisible moon in the sky. A sage with considerable skill in History or Arcana may recognize this as the moon Crya, thought to be destroyed in the Age of Giants…” In this interpretation Crya wasn’t blown up, it was pushed into Dal Quor and the door was closed behind it.
What about Atropus, from 3.5 Elder Evils?
I’ve never read Elder Evils, so I don’t have an opinion there. But Atropus as undead Crya is certainly a fun way to use it in Eberron.
“A True Story,” described as “the first known text that could be called science fiction,” does not just contain a moon kingdom. It also contains a sun kingdom. Do you have any ideas on how to integrate Arrah as an adventuring location?
Do you have any ideas on how to integrate Arrah as an adventuring location?
It seems like a great place for a brood of Solar Dragons to live…
Uprooted Oak with howling Wolves! We are SO on the same page, Keith!
Now, to read on!
What an absolutely fantastic article. I am greatly looking forward to seeing it unfold. In the meantime I’ll just be over here musing on how the Queens of Droaam can gargoyle flight and harpy song for a Spelljammer of their own.
Oh, I LOVE Droaam as a late, unexpected entry to the space race, and I’ll add the idea into a final article. I’d combine two key players in Droaam to design the Droaamite spelljammer. The core systems would be developed by the Venomous Demesne, perhaps harnessing some form of planar energy rather than elemental power… let’s bind a Fernian pit fiend to our ship! As for the hull, I’d use the facades from Lost—building sized mimics! Not only is it a living ship that can regenerate damage, it could shift it’s appearance to mimic a ship of another nation! And, as you suggest, gargoyles for EVA operations. I love it.
LIVING SHIPS FTW!
I have a space agency IME called The Wings of Droaam, which is my vessel for the most out-there methods of space travel in the setting: their signature is launching trolls into space with catapults, which inexplicably seems to *work* for them. I’d completely forgotten about the Demesne and Lost, though, so thank you for reminding me of them!
I’m fond of the idea of the lillends being the celestials of the Ring; while the couatl were born closer to Eberron, the lamenting songs of the lillends echo through the Ring.
They were born from within Siberys, and for millennia saw no mortals nor life; as far as they knew, the world had been ended in Siberys’ death. Thus, they exist in a state of ennui, and when they can fight their despair no longer, enter their “Silent Hour”:
>>> It was rumored that lillendi could choose the hour of their death. This was called the Silent Hour, and came when the lillend had grown weary of life and service. Before the Silent Hour, lillendi would make their goodbyes; if they began fighting during the Silent Hour, they fought fiercely with calm and focused fury. Lillendi who died in ways other than the Silent Hour were said to bear expressions of despair. The Silent Hour was said to either be a gift from the gods of the moon or a curse from the powers of law. (From the FR wiki)
However, they aren’t dying out; the energy released by a lillend undergoing their Silent Hour creates a new lillend, with no memories of their previous life and so the chance to grow up with wonder and hope again. Thus their theme is to be eternally fading, singing the last notes of Siberys’ dreams and creation into the empty void of stones and shards.
I like it!
Taking in the idea of there being oases within Siberyan asteroids, it could be that these were created/powered by the lillends, who create them as a way to stave off their ennui. Retrieving plants and creatures from the moons for their garden might be the best way to gain a lillend’s favour.
Also, a player character’s ship might be the first mortals a lillend has ever seen, especially given that those who remember the dragons’ or titans’ attempts to set up shop might have passed through their Silent Hour and thus their memories are gone.
Finally, I can see a PC bard introducing a new music to a lillend, proving that the forces of creation are still alive within mortals and that the ennui their race is plagued with may be curable.
This immediately gave me Enterprise tingles, just that paperclips and chewing gum sort of holding it together feel.
The Aundairan Flameblade from your barbarian article could make a decent barbarian option for an Aundairan ship, reimagining the rage as fighting trance and the unarmoured defense as low grade mage armour
Honestly just love the idea of a campaign like this, might have to start planning one
Did the Dhakaani ever make it into space?
Did the Dhakaani ever make it into space?
I don’t think I’d include them in space, no. The giants are specifically MORE advanced than modern Khorvaire and it makes sense for them to reach into space; they were already trying to conquer the planes, after all. The Dhakaani don’t have that same level of advancement and aren’t even presented as having crossed the oceans, let alone venturing into space. I could imagine there being a Dhakaani outpost in the Ring that somehow ended up there in a freak accident, but I wouldn’t make them a significant part of my campaign; I’d rather explore entirely new civilizations.
In Exploring Eberron, you suggest that stars are merely points of light in the inner lining of the crystal sphere. Some cultures in Eberron seem to ascribe importance to constellations, though, like Argonnessen associating constellations with draconic gods. Do you have any ideas for what adventurers might find if they push into space far, far, far enough to literally touch the stars themselves?
This gives me so many ideas about what cultures or things you’d find on each moon! Is Olarune a dense uninhabitable jungle world?
Is Therendor a gas giant whose gaseous clouds slowly heal living creatures?
I agree! As I said, I don’t want to get too specific about it in the article, because I want DMs to be able to embrace all those possibilities and for players to be legitimately venturing into the unknown… but that’s exactly the sort of wild, fantastical ideas I’d want to explore.
The weird thing about Olarune is that it’s *orange,* despite being the moon of the Twilight Wilds. You could justify that with strangely-colored vegetation. I made it a desert.
Is there mind flayers/Daelkyr in flying saucers up in Siberspace?
Mind flayers in space are a classic part of spelljammer. But how to reconcile this with their role in Eberron and Khyber? If mind flayers have spaceships, what have they been DOING with them in the thousands of years the daelkyr have been bound?
For me, I think the answer lies on Lharvion, the moon tied to Xoriat. We’ve said that Dyrrn is the overmind, the anchor of the illithid collective consciousness. But what if there’s a colony of mind flayers who broke their connection to Dyrrn and created their own unique mind and philosophy? Long story short: this seems like an excellent opportunity to do something with THOON, and to further say that the Thoon illithids explicitly avoid Eberron because they want to keep their distance from Dyrrn; they are preying on other lunar cultures, but don’t pass the Ring. Although, it would also be very interesting to pull a reveal later that Xorchyllic is from Lharvion, explaining their independence and seeming rivalry with Khyber.
I’ll also note that canonically, Lharvion is called “The Eye”. Could it be a giant beholder…?
Could these lunar mind flayers have some sort of teleportation that leaves crop circles as they gain subjects for experiments/food?
Xorchyllic ship sounds like a fun way to get the party in space. Using a vessel they don’t understand.
Thanks for the reply keith! I love it.
Seconding the question of where mind flayers might fit in to Siberspace, given their presence in classic Spelljammer.
I’ll go ahead and share my visions for the moons, since this is a new context from my usual project thread.
ZARANTYR is an ocean world, blanketed in constant storms and dotted with islands that drift on the water. It is sparsely inhabited, mostly by grungs and strange artist slaadi known as sculptor princes.
OLARUNE is a desert, due to an ancient disaster that killed its ecosystem – but the insistent power of Lamannia causes oases to constantly pop up just as fast as the desert can devour them. Asherati clans and a bhuka society descended from pre-Dhakaani goblins wander its surface as nomads.
THERENDOR’s atmosphere is toxic to most forms of life, though its mountains reach high enough to pierce the safe upper layers. Its inhabitants are often scavengers gathering refuse that falls from Syrania high above. Hidden somewhere on its surface is an ancient teleportation hub used by the thri-kreen.
EYRE is a hot, rocky wasteland and has no organic life. It has a vibrant construct ecology, however, in large part because the power of Fernia is known to cause inanimate objects to gain sentience. The moon itself, in particular, is alive and has uncertain goals for the moon.
DRAVAGO is an ocean the entire way through to its core, with a thick ice sheet on the surface. Few creatures live there, but it is rich in alchemical resources, kept stable by the frigid cold of Risia.
NYMM is a lively world home to several civilizations, though the great Empire of New Nulakesh has recently fallen, giving way to local rule by organized crime. The sea itself is golden and has properties similar to a Lawful Neutral Silver Flame.
LHARVION is hollow, with a barren exterior and a wild, vibrant inner surface. Aberrations of all stripes live here, in constant tension between the madness of Xoriat and the sanity of Eberron. Most notably, it is home to the silthilar and the tsochari.
BARRAKAS is the dark side of Irian: a lush land ruled by cults of mindless bliss, repressive optimism, righteous conquest, crushing growth, and reckless creation. In the midst of it all, the remarkably sane Mjesac trolls have carved out a place for themselves. Nearly everything on the moon’s surface is faintly luminescent.
RHAAN is home to the Crescent Barons, a court of twelve archfey who represent the other moons besides Rhaan itself (including the enigmatic Baron Crya). Also living on the moon is a faerie greatwyrm, The Laughing Wyrm, and a culture of fey raiders, the Lunar Ravagers.
SYPHEROS experiences mass extinctions every five years under the influence of Mabar, but in between, life springs up rapidly in the decay from the previous cycle. Vegepygmies are its most notable inhabitants, the people who grow out of the rot, but it is also home to the remnants of the thri-kreen civilization, as well as the umber hulks, who may have been the first spacefarers in the system.
ARYTH is a gaseous moon, inhabited mostly by incorporeal undead who live in fear of both the sun and the agents of Dolurrh.
VULT, where life exists primarily in swampy craters. is a world of constant aggression, and societies there can only survive by finding ways to channel that aggression – anything from blood sports to lively debate and strict meditation regimens. On the far side, an uneasy alliance of aasimar and tieflings fights off an increasingly intense invasion of star spawn.
CRYA, wherever it is, is cut off from the multiverse. Illusions are now permanent and cannot be dispelled, creating an increasingly diverse ecology of phantasmal creatures. Dreamers and the dead cannot leave the moon, so the spirits of the sleeping and dead still walk its surface. Amid all this, the quaggoths eke out a tenuous existence.
Side note: Keith’s suggestion for a campaign structure sounds a lot like an RPG system called Band of Blades that I’ve been meaning to try, with the whole layout of alternating between adventure scenarios and administrative sessions that decide the direction of the whole organization.
As house Lyrandar is more involved with the Brelish side of the space race, would it be possible for house Orien as the other house involved with travel to be more involved with the Aundairians? The headquarter of the house is in Aundair. This could also increase the rivalry between Lyrandar and Orien.
Another option for Orien could be to support one of the other space ships, based on the houses research of teleportation options. A teleportation driven spelljamming device.
This is exactly what I presented in this article; my first version of the Dragonhawk Initiative was driven by teleportation. I specifically chose not to include it here because I’m not looking for a viable alternative to a spaceship; I want there to be space battles and ships passing through Shavaran Bloodstorms. I considered the idea that it would be more about them setting up teleportation circles to supply outposts, but to some degree my concern is that this would undermine the importance of space travel and give the nation using them too much of an advantage.
So essentially, it’s POSSIBLE, certainly. But it’s not what I personally want to do for this campaign.
Alright, for the « Eberron is connected to the wider multiverse » school of thought, here is how I envision things :
According to Fizban’s Treasury of Dragons there where a First World populated by primordial, deity-like dragons that waged a war against the gods of the Outer Planes (let us call them outer gods) which resulted in the destruction of the First World. I like to think that Siberys, Eberron and Khyber were survivors of this war, who developed an absolute hatred for the outer gods, and used the remnants of their power to craft the Siberspace/thirteen planes, with the following properties :
– Firstly and foremost, NO OUTER GOD CAN REACH, MANIFEST THEMSELVES, OF INFLUENCE THE SIBERSPACE IN ANY WAY. If an outer god tries to act, they would be drained of their power, potentially killing them (to give you an idea, look about the Source Wall in DC comics). This would imply to accept the idea that the gods in Eberron, if they exist, cannot manifest an avatar/identity/personality, ever.
– Secondly, the purpose of the 13 moons is to “anchor” the 13 planes to the Siberspace, so that there remain isolated from the Outer Planes of the Great Wheel.
– Thirdly, portals to Sigil (a no-gods city) and Spelljamming would be the only ways to leave the Siberspace. In previous editions, it was through the phlogliston, another ‘no-gods’ zone. In 5e, probably through the Astral plane (full of dead gods), and the colours pools/astral gates in Eberron are also of different colors than the rest of the Outer planes, adding another layer of difficulty.
As a conclusion, the progenitors dragons isolated their created world from the wider multiverse to prevent the outer gods from influencing their mortals, but while the world of Eberron CAN interact with other materials worlds, it can only be done by mortal races, and it is exponentially harder by design.
I am absolutely over the moon(s) with the great combination of my two favorite settings! On a ship with Lyrandar pilot, do you still need a spell jamming helm? Or do you need both–the pilot for controlling the elemental, the helmsman to navigate in wildspace?
Or do you need both–the pilot for controlling the elemental, the helmsman to navigate in wildspace?
My inclination would be to combine the two—that the Argosy has essentially adapted the elemental airship to space, so the one pilot performs both functions.
nooo not more motivation to work on writing up the moons as adventure locations, I’m neglecting too many projects already
You’re doing this too? I’ve been working on something similar in the Eberron server for about nine months. 😀 I’d love to hear about what you’ve been doing.
Virtually nothing because I went “hey, I should do that” two weeks ago and then got distracted by those other projects. I have a vague selection of ideas but no actual concrete stuff written down.
I saw your post about this very co stuff. Interestingly enough I’ve been doing the same thing. I’ve made the distinction of term “Moon” a hold over from dimensional settlers that occupied Eberron in ancient time. I’ve actually mapped a solar system where eberron is the middle planet so the other moons/planets which share much closer orbital tracs than we experience in our solar system. Anyway a meteor crashed onto the Eberron on long shadows and set some pretty nasty stuff in motion. Anyway they are about to start uncovering an expedition that has been shipping Gith machine parts to a manufacturer in Aundair who is building a spelljamer.
I know that normally the mournland as being like, 200 m tall, but what if it was actually infinite in height? What kind of interesting stuff a spacejamming ship could find there?
*normally hte mournland is treated as being like, 200 m tall,
Oh, and to add to that, what if new Cyre is starting to theorize the answers to the mournland are in syberspace? How would they try to enter the space race?
Assuming they’re luck, Perhaps Dannel left some secret blueprints, found in the ruins of metrol, and they are trying to use there? if so, what would these ships look like?
How would they try to enter the space race?
I suggest the idea that they could be late-game entrants. The main issue is that they simply don’t have the resources to run a space program; it’s not like New Cyre as presented has the facilities to compete with the broader industry of Breland. Which leaves a few possibilities…
1. A group of Cyrans—TOTALLY unrelated to Oargev, COMPLETELY independent, wink wink—hijack a spelljammer belonging to another nation.
2. Forget blueprints; Cyre was ALREADY WORKING ON SPACE TRAVEL BEFORE THE MOURNING and there are two working spelljammers in a secret hanger in the Mournland. The trick is sending a team that can find the hanger, secure it, and then launch the spelljammers — as well as hoping they haven’t been somehow corrupted by the Mournland.
There are some opportunities here for something like Operation Paperclip in real life – the US effort to snap up Nazi scientists after WWII to work for them. Finding surviving members of the Cyran space program to “recruit” (or kidnap) for another nation’s space program – or a player character BEING such a scientist who wants to avoid being kidnapped – is another potential hook.
The first option seems like a very cool first session, ngl.
Thanks keith!
One thing that Spelljammer seems to be bringing to the foreground of 5e is the silly side of D&D—plasmoids, space hamsters, dohwar, etc. To what extent would you want to bring in the sillier side of pulp while running Spelljammer in Eberron?
Eberron stands on the precipice of pulp and noir. The political intrigue I’ve described is more noir, but I think there’s still room to have a nation of Dohwar on the Dravago; I already suggested plasmoids on Zarantyr. Of course, I personally would start out with plasmoids being hilarious and then reveal that they are, in fact, horrifying.
Speaking of “anchors”:
I think of the kar’lassa as “anchors” of the moons. I like the idea that the moons themselves “anchor” the planes. I have the nodes of each moon (where they cross the ecliptic) rotate according to the coterminous cycles, similar to the 18.6 year nodal cycle of our IRL moon, Luna.
I like the idea that the moons themselves “anchor” the planes.
… Which is in keeping with the fact that the loss of Crya cut Dal Quor loose from the material.
I imagine the Cul’sir Dominion having used captured quori spirits to power their “spelljammer” ships!
Keith, do you have any thoughts on the hypothesis that the Cul’sir giants may have occupied Crya, weighed anchor (hoisting the kar’lassa of Dal Quor and stowing it on the moon, then setting out toward (and through) the crystal sphere of fixed stars?
Fantastic article, BTW!!!
Keith, do you have any thoughts on the hypothesis that the Cul’sir giants may have occupied Crya…
I think it sounds like something that would be printed in the Sharn Inquisitive as opposed to the Korranberg Chronicle… but if it’s the story you want to tell, go for it!
Those gnomes gnow too much!
Having the lost giants of Crya seems like a great way to incorporate the arcane/mercane of Spelljammer.
Hey Keith I have a question to throw on the pile. Are there any passageways or methods of crossing over from the manifest worlds to the planes themselves? Perhaps opened up by the giants prior to their disappearance.
It’s definitely possible; manifest zones can often serve as portals. But personally I don’t want it to be the primary focus of the moons; I’m more interested in having adventurers encounter things they wouldn’t find anywhere else, as opposed to having essentially the same adventure they could have in the Whitehorn Woods back home.
Keith, would you imagine Pylas Pyrial (if it isn’t already on Rhaan) would get involved with the Argosy via Zilargo? I’d written some blurbs for them on a similar theme to the fey magic stuff you have for the Dragonhawk Initiative, but now that the Initiative is being characterized as the Fey Space Guys I’m a bit worried about redundancy.
Keith, would you imagine Pylas Pyrial (if it isn’t already on Rhaan) would get involved with the Argosy via Zilargo?
Could *I* imagine it? No, not particularly. But that shouldn’t keep YOU from imagining it.
To me, the basic theme of Breland is pragmatic industry. Of the Five Nations, they have the least religion and the most crime. The basic principle of the Argosy is “How can we make a profit from this space thing?” None of that is in keeping with Pylas Pyrial, which is fundamentally driven by whimsy and joy. The Pyrial article says “The spire rejects those who come with greed in their hearts, and the Zil don’t spread word of its existence“; they just aren’t a match to the story I’m trying to tell here, which is about cold war ambition. By contrast, the Dragonhawk Initiative is working with the Mother of Invention, whose story is DEFINED by ambitious invention—albeit, ambition that doesn’t always end well! But essentially, when I think “whimsical romance” Breland is not the nation that comes to mind; whereas in wanting a nation that’s aligned with industry and profit, it is.
But again, that’s how *I* see Breland and Pyrial. If you’ve already written something for your campaign that links the two together, you tell the story you want to tell! What *I* do shouldn’t stop you from doing what *you* want to do.
Exploring Eberron says that “[Khyber Demiplanes] may have two or more portals, each leading to anywhere on the Material Plane.” Can they lead to one of the moons?
The moons are on the material plane, so it’s certainly POSSIBLE. However, as I mention elsewhere, I’m mainly interested in having adventures in space people couldn’t have at home. So finding a demiplane connection would be an exceptionally rare once-in-a-campaign sort of event—the amazing twist that gives the adventurers a chance to get home after their ship crashes on an extremely hostile moon—not something that would be turning up in every adventure.
What prevents easy teleportation across various celestial bodies? Consider, say, the D&D 5e rules for the Teleportation Circle and Teleport spells, or even a Plane Shift spell (used from another plane, with the intended destination of “X moon in the Material Plane”).
Good question. I’ve just added the answer to the main post: The Ring of Siberys is suffused with arcane energy, which has many effects. It overloads divination magic… This field also blocks all forms of teleportation, preventing anyone from teleporting to or from the surface of Eberron, or teleporting beyond the Ring; you can’t teleport directly from Eberron to one of the moons. Short-distance teleportation effects can be used within the Ring itself, but cannot be used to leave it entirely. As with divination. this is a restriction that could be overcome in time as people study this effect and improve their magic. House Orien can’t set up a teleportation circle in the Ring TODAY, but given enough time they could develop a focus item that makes it possible.
That’s the practical answer. For the meta-answer, it’s because I don’t WANT travel to be that easy. In 3.5, teleportation circle was a 9th level spell, and the culture of the Five Nations was built on the idea that it was not an option; the best Orien could provide was Teleport, which had many limitations (look to page 11 of Secrets of Xen’drik for a discussion of this). As originally envisioned, Khorvaire isn’t supposed to have an easy, cheap network of teleportation circles; in particular, in 3.5 this is called out as a major difference between Khorvaire and Riedra, which DOES have a network of circles. 4th and 5th editions complicated things by making Teleportation Circles lower level magic, which threatens the need for the lightning rail or airship; why would you bother taking the lightning rail if it only costs 50 gp to circle-teleport between Wroat and Korth? With this in mind, Rising From The Last War asserts that Orien HAS circles, but it costs 2,500 gp to use one—implying though not explicitly stating that Orien’s system uses more expensive components than the standard spell… because, again, teleportation isn’t supposed to be part of everyday life in the Five Nations. This same principle applies to the space race. I don’t WANT people to be able to set up a teleportation circle on the moon and then be able to immediately bounce back and forth whenever they wish, because I want to run a campaign it which the exploration of the moons is difficult and dangerous. But as noted, the idea is that it could be possible in the future, but it will require an evolution of arcane science—because that’s always been a core idea of Eberron, that magic is a form of science. I don’t want it to be easy, but I’m fine with the idea that once Orien discovers they can’t teleport to the moons, they start feverishly working on a focus item that will allow them to punch through the interference of the Ring.
Plane Shift is a special case. The Ring blocks point to point teleportation, but it’s an obstacle within the material plane; I think that Plane Shift would allow you to teleport from one of the planes to any point in the material plane, on a moon or on Eberron, although I’d require the caster to be familiar with the location; in my campaign, someone can’t just say “Take me to Zarantyr!” if they’ve never been there. So this is a way to travel between Eberron and the moons—but it’s also a 7th level spell, which does place it beyond the capabilities of the Five Nations.
Is a Khyber demiplane considered part of Eberron for this point-to-point blocking?
What about divination from another plane? If the caster is unambiguously in another plane, can a divination gather information on one of the moons?
Is a Khyber demiplane considered part of Eberron for this point-to-point blocking?
A demiplane isn’t part of the material plane and I wouldn’t allow any teleportation that’s linked to being on the same plane to cross between demiplanes or between a demiplane and the material plane. In my campaign, this is why rakshasas have Plane Shift; they don’t usually go to OTHER planes, but it allows them to return to the heart demiplane of their overlord.
What about divination from another plane? If the caster is unambiguously in another plane, can a divination gather information on one of the moons?
The effect of the Ring itself mimics Nondetection, which says “The target can’t be targeted by any divination magic or perceived through magical scrying sensors.” In terms of the moons, sure, if you’re in another plane and using a form of divination that can operate across planes, then you could bypass this barrier and gather information on a moon. If I wanted to be picky about it I might say that this only works if you’re on the plane that’s connected to the moon in question.
Creating a Teleportation Circle takes time:
“You can create a permanent teleportation circle by casting this spell in the same location every day for one year. You need not use the circle to teleport when you cast the spell in this way.”
So, it would require a safe base on a moon or Siberys ring chunk in order to set up a destination circle.
Until then, only one-way travel back to an already established terrestrial (Eberronestrial?) Teleportation Circle would be possible. And this teleportation across the ring could be susceptible to interference equivalent to ‘Viewed Casually’ to ‘Viewed Once’ from the Teleport spell (depending on whether the destination was line-of-sight above or through the ring).
Excellent point; it’s not like you could instantly set up a teleportation circle to a Ring outpost.
But at the same time, a basic principle of Eberron is that arcane magic is a form of science, and one of the defining features of science is that it evolves. I like the idea that when we get into space, there are things don’t work the way we’re used to and we have to experiment and work to overcome those challenges. I like the idea that we need to figure out WHY we can’t teleport to or from the Ring and to find a way to overcome that interference; to me, that’s more of an Eberron story than to say that teleportation is an absolute, it’s as good as it will ever be, it works exactly the same on the Ring as it does in Sharn.
So you’re correct that even by the RAW there are challenges to teleportation. But as I said, I like the idea that getting divination and teleportation to work in the Ring would take work—and that these would be exactly the sorts of choices that players would have to decide in the interludes. Do you invest your resources in teleportation experiments or do you focus on building more ships?
I can absolutely see how the Argosy would proceed based on what you’ve presented here. It make sense for a more pragmatic nation/alliance to focus on using tried-and-true methods to expand into new uses, that’s the faster method to get the job done, even if it’s not as elegant a method as something new created.
I do admit though I’m a little inspired by the thought that Karnath, or some other group with expertise in necromancy, was working on a spelljammer that utilized the skeleton of a giant creature as foundation, animating it with necromancy to handle the majority of movement.
Or a group from the Twelve working on a construct ship utilizing parts salvaged from warforged colossi from the Mournland, that could be largely self-sufficient in wildspace.
Oooh, another idea, setting up a space train line to and from one of the larger asteroids in the Ring, or a new floating base near the ring, would be an amazing adventure, and might interest House Orien, as it would call upon their training in running the lightning rail!
Do the moons receive Siberys shard showers? Can they acquire Siberys dragonshards that way?
Do the moons receive Siberys shard showers? Can they acquire Siberys dragonshards that way?
Not in my campaign. The ring surrounds Eberron; the moons are beyond it. I’d make the Ring itself the primary source of siberys shards in space, and give the moons entirely unqiue magical resources.
Question about the relation of Siberspace and the Astral. The new Spelljammer book asserts “If you were to leave your home world and continue outward until you neared the edge of your Wildspace system, you would begin to see a faint, silvery haze. By traveling into this haze, you pass from Wildspace into the Astral Sea…Wildspace and the Astral Sea together comprise the Astral Plane”
– Source: Brandes Stoddard’s preview thread
Would you keep this as true? If so, how big is Siberspace?
Would you keep this as true?
I may change my mind when I read the book, but my inclination is no, I’d keep my depiction from Exploring Eberron. I still like the concept of The Truman Show moment when you point your vessel to deep space, set forth… and run into the wall at the edge of the system, in which the stars are just glittering stones. It emphasizes the idea that while we don’t know if there is any actual truth to the creation myth, Eberron is a constructed artifact—a metaphysical machine that was intentionally isolated from the rest of the multiverse. And with that in mind, I want the border between the Astral and the Material to be more significant than just flying in one direction for a very long time. In essence, I want it to be the difference between warp drive and impulse drive. Impulse is all you need to explore the moons and the Ring. But to venture beyond that will take an even more significant breakthrough in arcane science.
To me, the key is that the Wildspace/Astral idea here is designed to facilitate travel between the worlds of the multiverse. Which is great! But as I say here, that’s not what I want to do in this campaign, so I’d stick with localized interpretation that keeps Eberron isolated from Krynn or Toril. Figuring out how to pierce the barrier between the material and the astral would be a dramatic part of the final phase of the campaign—and finding out how to travel from Eberron’s astral to a different wildspace system would likely be the endgame moment, as the adventurers disappear into the ultimate unknown.
So I agree that Sol Udar is keeping the Mror busy, but the Earth’s first three space-faring nations all did so while conducting at least one war. There just have to be some iconoclast clans and individuals, seeking bold opportunities above.
-As the highest active volcano north of equatorial Xen’drik, can the Fist of Onatar provide enough starting altitude & elemental/manifest zone launching power? Do you see the location as more likely to be leased or violently appropriated?
-Will the draconic scholar known only by the nom de plume, ‘Fernian Bovine’ finally acknowledge authorship of a thesis claiming proof the Jhorash’tar orcs are escaped slave descendants from the neogi slaver fleet responsible for the complete depopulation of Noldrun? Furthermore, could these refugees be persuaded to reveal their secret knowledge of several small spelljammer engines, allow them to be dug up, reconstructed, and used to mount a rescue of the lost clan?
-Because the products and the techniques will be critical in keeping ship crews alive in the rigors of space and hostile moon manifest worlds, which nations are contracting with Soldorak, Soranath, & Narathun for fleshcrafting?
-If space-race is the theme, then The Right Stuff is the first game session! What sort of challenges would you have players create/overcome in qualifying for a ship’s crew? Do Karnns have to practice being resuscitated from heart failure? Do Aundairans have to take on a mission-specific geas from a fey before every launch?
-Astronauts, spacefarers, or Sibersailors?
If space-race is the theme, then The Right Stuff is the first game session!
I’m inclined to say that it’s the Session Zero, actually. I wouldn’t want to play out the tests unless there was an actual chance for failure, and I don’t want to spend that much time sorting out the characters before getting to the action. So I’m more inclined to make it a part of session zero and character conception—Why were you chosen? How did you handle (specific challenge)?
Looking to the Holds, I don’t really feel that I’d have a clan as a whole pursuing a space program. We haven’t presented Mror clans as, for example, pursuing the exploration of Xen’drik or opportunities in Q’barra, both of which are far easier to reach than the moons. Certainly, you could have bold individuals, just as I had Mror investors in my Q’barra and Threshold campaigns… but in both examples, those bold individuals are members of the Aurum, which after all began in the Holds. Again, that shouldn’t stop you from pursuing a more aggressive approach with the Holds in your campaign, but in mine I think you’d see a Soldorak or Narathun concordian funding an Aurum vessel.
Are there stars and constellations in siberspace? Would you have them as points for navigation or artifacts, locations, entities to interact with?
Per Exploring Eberron: “There are stars in the sky of Eberron, but they aren’t the anchors of distant solar systems. There are limits to the Material Plane, and the stars mark those limits; think of them as glittering points in a crystal sphere. The common constellations are figures of ancient dragons—Io, Tiamat, Chronepsis—though most people couldn’t actually say where these names come from. It’s generally assumed that they were handed down by one of the ancient kingdoms of Sarlona, or established by the ancestors of the Aereni—but in fact, the names are from a tradition spread by the sages of Argonnessen.”
I’ll note that these constellations are depicted in the original 3.5 Eberron Campaign Setting book.
The Dragon Gods are one of the few direct translations of dieties from the multiverse to Eberron.
What does the presence of their belief say about Siberspace’s connection to the d&d multiverse?
The Dragon Gods are one of the few direct translations of dieties from the multiverse to Eberron. What does the presence of their belief say about Siberspace’s connection to the d&d multiverse?
Eberron’s canonical connection to the multiverse is clearly called out on page 228 of Eberron: Rising From The Last War. “Eberron is part of the Great Wheel of the multiverse… At the same time, it is fundamentally apart from the rest of the Great Wheel, sealed off from the other planes even while it’s encircled by its own wheeling cosmology. Eberron’s unqiue station in the multiverse is an important aspect of the world… it is sheltered from the influences and machinations of gods and other powers elsewhere in the Great Wheel.”
Page 232 expands on this connection: “The three progenitor wyrms worked together to form Eberron and its planes as a new cosmic system in the depths of the etheral plane. The recreated the elves, orcs, dragons, and other races found throughout the multiverse, but allowed them to develop beyond the reach of Gruumsh, Corellon, Lolth, and other influences… in your campaign you might decide that the barrier formed by the Ring of Siberys is intact, and contact between Eberron and the worlds and planes beyond its cosmology is impossible. This is the default assumption of this book. On the other hand… it could be that the protection offered by the Ring of Siberys has begun to fail...” and that wider travel within the Multiverse is possible.
So even in the default version, Eberron IS part of the multiverse and it’s possible someone could slip out—as with Jeremy Crawford’s character V, or my playing a warforged from Eberron in an FR campaign. But the default is that such contact is rare and remarkable. Nothing about the myths of the Dragon Gods undermines this. As spelled out in Dragons of Eberron, the dragons believe that the Progenitors created reality, and that the Dragon Gods exist on a higher level of existence “that cannot be reached with any mortal magic“—like the Sovereigns, they can offer guidance (at least, the faithful BELIEVE they do, with no more evidence than the followers any other religion) but don’t physically appear. Which is in keeping with the basic idea; when the Progenitors created reality, they put the dragon god constellations in the sky and shared the stories of them. The dragon gods DO exist, but outside of the barrier, in the wider multiverse—and again, WITHIN Eberron, they serve the same role as the Sovereigns, just specifically for dragons.
Again, canonically, Eberron IS part of the multiverse; it’s just REALLY HARD TO REACH IT, unless a DM decides to change that.
Do autognomes have Ghulra?
No. They aren’t created using creation forges, and don’t all use the same basic systems. They’re sentient constructs, but they’re not warforged… which is why Merrix has been able to get away with creating them.
I’ve been thinking quite alot about Spelljammer in Eberron and am curious; If there is a Siberys Space, is there a Khyber space?
We know Khyber is an interconnected web of realities that acts as an interstitial space between all places in the greater Eberron cosmology.
So is it possible that Spelljammer could Access it to move at “Warp speed” like in star trek and star wars or move through the “Warp” like in event horizon or Warhammer 40,000. Engage “Khyber Speed” or maybe “Khyber Drive” then the vessel explodes foward through a tear in space, then passes through Khyber space, moving through Khyber for a short time would greatly reduce travel time but there is a cost- it would expose them to the raw eldritch taint of the realm.
I love this idea, what do you think?
Keith, I don’t truthfully have any questions, but I want to say that I’m blown away by this. The ideas and pitches as part of it leap off the page, begging to be run – if you’d ever have any interest in fleshing this out into a Guild release, it would be an incredibly fine book! I love the way you’ve made each nation’s spelljamming effort feel so distinct, especially with the unique crew roles available – the fey Warlock-diplomats and Paladin marine leader both rock. Keeping it as Eberron-centric in scope feels true to the setting in a really great way. Thank you for this!
I honestly can’t believe you even found a way to make Autognomes cool!
Oh, one final thought: the idea of the Karrn space program trying to mollify Seekers by making them a key part of their efforts is BRILLIANT! I’m a sucker for all things Karrnathi internal politics.
Thanks! I’m glad you like the idea.
Are there any other worlds in Siberspace orbiting Arrah?
Following.
Do you want there to be? My previous descriptions have said no, because I like to keep the focus on Eberron. If you assume that there’s some sort of truth to the creation myth, Eberron IS the center of the material plane; what role do these other planets play in that story? Ultimately, I feel that I have enough room with the twelve moons and the Ring—not to mention mysterious wildspace manifest zone phenomena, and the infinite space of the Astral—that I don’t really need other entire separate worlds; the moons effectively are different worlds, and there’s twelve to explore. But as noted in the new article, there’s no reason YOU have to be limited by that preference. If you want there to be more planets in the system, add what you need!
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Under your current vision, how would you implement the remnants of the moon Crya, which might be valuable to anyone with a stake in Dal Quor? What about Atropus, from 3.5 Elder Evils? What about removing the canonical 3.5 Elder Evils suggestion for Atropus in Eberron, and making Atropus an undead Crya?
Under your current vision, how would you implement the remnants of the moon Crya…
In MY vision, you won’t find pieces of Crya in orbit. Exploring Eberron notes “In those regions of il-Lashtavar that appear to be outdoors, adventurers may notice a dark, nearly invisible moon in the sky. A sage with considerable skill in History or Arcana may recognize this as the moon Crya, thought to be destroyed in the Age of Giants…” In this interpretation Crya wasn’t blown up, it was pushed into Dal Quor and the door was closed behind it.
What about Atropus, from 3.5 Elder Evils?
I’ve never read Elder Evils, so I don’t have an opinion there. But Atropus as undead Crya is certainly a fun way to use it in Eberron.
“A True Story,” described as “the first known text that could be called science fiction,” does not just contain a moon kingdom. It also contains a sun kingdom. Do you have any ideas on how to integrate Arrah as an adventuring location?
Do you have any ideas on how to integrate Arrah as an adventuring location?
It seems like a great place for a brood of Solar Dragons to live…
Uprooted Oak with howling Wolves! We are SO on the same page, Keith!
Now, to read on!
What an absolutely fantastic article. I am greatly looking forward to seeing it unfold. In the meantime I’ll just be over here musing on how the Queens of Droaam can gargoyle flight and harpy song for a Spelljammer of their own.
Oh, I LOVE Droaam as a late, unexpected entry to the space race, and I’ll add the idea into a final article. I’d combine two key players in Droaam to design the Droaamite spelljammer. The core systems would be developed by the Venomous Demesne, perhaps harnessing some form of planar energy rather than elemental power… let’s bind a Fernian pit fiend to our ship! As for the hull, I’d use the facades from Lost—building sized mimics! Not only is it a living ship that can regenerate damage, it could shift it’s appearance to mimic a ship of another nation! And, as you suggest, gargoyles for EVA operations. I love it.
LIVING SHIPS FTW!
I have a space agency IME called The Wings of Droaam, which is my vessel for the most out-there methods of space travel in the setting: their signature is launching trolls into space with catapults, which inexplicably seems to *work* for them. I’d completely forgotten about the Demesne and Lost, though, so thank you for reminding me of them!
I’m fond of the idea of the lillends being the celestials of the Ring; while the couatl were born closer to Eberron, the lamenting songs of the lillends echo through the Ring.
They were born from within Siberys, and for millennia saw no mortals nor life; as far as they knew, the world had been ended in Siberys’ death. Thus, they exist in a state of ennui, and when they can fight their despair no longer, enter their “Silent Hour”:
>>> It was rumored that lillendi could choose the hour of their death. This was called the Silent Hour, and came when the lillend had grown weary of life and service. Before the Silent Hour, lillendi would make their goodbyes; if they began fighting during the Silent Hour, they fought fiercely with calm and focused fury. Lillendi who died in ways other than the Silent Hour were said to bear expressions of despair. The Silent Hour was said to either be a gift from the gods of the moon or a curse from the powers of law. (From the FR wiki)
However, they aren’t dying out; the energy released by a lillend undergoing their Silent Hour creates a new lillend, with no memories of their previous life and so the chance to grow up with wonder and hope again. Thus their theme is to be eternally fading, singing the last notes of Siberys’ dreams and creation into the empty void of stones and shards.
I like it!
Taking in the idea of there being oases within Siberyan asteroids, it could be that these were created/powered by the lillends, who create them as a way to stave off their ennui. Retrieving plants and creatures from the moons for their garden might be the best way to gain a lillend’s favour.
Also, a player character’s ship might be the first mortals a lillend has ever seen, especially given that those who remember the dragons’ or titans’ attempts to set up shop might have passed through their Silent Hour and thus their memories are gone.
Finally, I can see a PC bard introducing a new music to a lillend, proving that the forces of creation are still alive within mortals and that the ennui their race is plagued with may be curable.
This immediately gave me Enterprise tingles, just that paperclips and chewing gum sort of holding it together feel.
The Aundairan Flameblade from your barbarian article could make a decent barbarian option for an Aundairan ship, reimagining the rage as fighting trance and the unarmoured defense as low grade mage armour
Honestly just love the idea of a campaign like this, might have to start planning one
Did the Dhakaani ever make it into space?
Did the Dhakaani ever make it into space?
I don’t think I’d include them in space, no. The giants are specifically MORE advanced than modern Khorvaire and it makes sense for them to reach into space; they were already trying to conquer the planes, after all. The Dhakaani don’t have that same level of advancement and aren’t even presented as having crossed the oceans, let alone venturing into space. I could imagine there being a Dhakaani outpost in the Ring that somehow ended up there in a freak accident, but I wouldn’t make them a significant part of my campaign; I’d rather explore entirely new civilizations.
In Exploring Eberron, you suggest that stars are merely points of light in the inner lining of the crystal sphere. Some cultures in Eberron seem to ascribe importance to constellations, though, like Argonnessen associating constellations with draconic gods. Do you have any ideas for what adventurers might find if they push into space far, far, far enough to literally touch the stars themselves?
This gives me so many ideas about what cultures or things you’d find on each moon! Is Olarune a dense uninhabitable jungle world?
Is Therendor a gas giant whose gaseous clouds slowly heal living creatures?
I agree! As I said, I don’t want to get too specific about it in the article, because I want DMs to be able to embrace all those possibilities and for players to be legitimately venturing into the unknown… but that’s exactly the sort of wild, fantastical ideas I’d want to explore.
The weird thing about Olarune is that it’s *orange,* despite being the moon of the Twilight Wilds. You could justify that with strangely-colored vegetation. I made it a desert.
Is there mind flayers/Daelkyr in flying saucers up in Siberspace?
Mind flayers in space are a classic part of spelljammer. But how to reconcile this with their role in Eberron and Khyber? If mind flayers have spaceships, what have they been DOING with them in the thousands of years the daelkyr have been bound?
For me, I think the answer lies on Lharvion, the moon tied to Xoriat. We’ve said that Dyrrn is the overmind, the anchor of the illithid collective consciousness. But what if there’s a colony of mind flayers who broke their connection to Dyrrn and created their own unique mind and philosophy? Long story short: this seems like an excellent opportunity to do something with THOON, and to further say that the Thoon illithids explicitly avoid Eberron because they want to keep their distance from Dyrrn; they are preying on other lunar cultures, but don’t pass the Ring. Although, it would also be very interesting to pull a reveal later that Xorchyllic is from Lharvion, explaining their independence and seeming rivalry with Khyber.
I’ll also note that canonically, Lharvion is called “The Eye”. Could it be a giant beholder…?
Could these lunar mind flayers have some sort of teleportation that leaves crop circles as they gain subjects for experiments/food?
Xorchyllic ship sounds like a fun way to get the party in space. Using a vessel they don’t understand.
Thanks for the reply keith! I love it.
Seconding the question of where mind flayers might fit in to Siberspace, given their presence in classic Spelljammer.
I’ll go ahead and share my visions for the moons, since this is a new context from my usual project thread.
ZARANTYR is an ocean world, blanketed in constant storms and dotted with islands that drift on the water. It is sparsely inhabited, mostly by grungs and strange artist slaadi known as sculptor princes.
OLARUNE is a desert, due to an ancient disaster that killed its ecosystem – but the insistent power of Lamannia causes oases to constantly pop up just as fast as the desert can devour them. Asherati clans and a bhuka society descended from pre-Dhakaani goblins wander its surface as nomads.
THERENDOR’s atmosphere is toxic to most forms of life, though its mountains reach high enough to pierce the safe upper layers. Its inhabitants are often scavengers gathering refuse that falls from Syrania high above. Hidden somewhere on its surface is an ancient teleportation hub used by the thri-kreen.
EYRE is a hot, rocky wasteland and has no organic life. It has a vibrant construct ecology, however, in large part because the power of Fernia is known to cause inanimate objects to gain sentience. The moon itself, in particular, is alive and has uncertain goals for the moon.
DRAVAGO is an ocean the entire way through to its core, with a thick ice sheet on the surface. Few creatures live there, but it is rich in alchemical resources, kept stable by the frigid cold of Risia.
NYMM is a lively world home to several civilizations, though the great Empire of New Nulakesh has recently fallen, giving way to local rule by organized crime. The sea itself is golden and has properties similar to a Lawful Neutral Silver Flame.
LHARVION is hollow, with a barren exterior and a wild, vibrant inner surface. Aberrations of all stripes live here, in constant tension between the madness of Xoriat and the sanity of Eberron. Most notably, it is home to the silthilar and the tsochari.
BARRAKAS is the dark side of Irian: a lush land ruled by cults of mindless bliss, repressive optimism, righteous conquest, crushing growth, and reckless creation. In the midst of it all, the remarkably sane Mjesac trolls have carved out a place for themselves. Nearly everything on the moon’s surface is faintly luminescent.
RHAAN is home to the Crescent Barons, a court of twelve archfey who represent the other moons besides Rhaan itself (including the enigmatic Baron Crya). Also living on the moon is a faerie greatwyrm, The Laughing Wyrm, and a culture of fey raiders, the Lunar Ravagers.
SYPHEROS experiences mass extinctions every five years under the influence of Mabar, but in between, life springs up rapidly in the decay from the previous cycle. Vegepygmies are its most notable inhabitants, the people who grow out of the rot, but it is also home to the remnants of the thri-kreen civilization, as well as the umber hulks, who may have been the first spacefarers in the system.
ARYTH is a gaseous moon, inhabited mostly by incorporeal undead who live in fear of both the sun and the agents of Dolurrh.
VULT, where life exists primarily in swampy craters. is a world of constant aggression, and societies there can only survive by finding ways to channel that aggression – anything from blood sports to lively debate and strict meditation regimens. On the far side, an uneasy alliance of aasimar and tieflings fights off an increasingly intense invasion of star spawn.
CRYA, wherever it is, is cut off from the multiverse. Illusions are now permanent and cannot be dispelled, creating an increasingly diverse ecology of phantasmal creatures. Dreamers and the dead cannot leave the moon, so the spirits of the sleeping and dead still walk its surface. Amid all this, the quaggoths eke out a tenuous existence.
Side note: Keith’s suggestion for a campaign structure sounds a lot like an RPG system called Band of Blades that I’ve been meaning to try, with the whole layout of alternating between adventure scenarios and administrative sessions that decide the direction of the whole organization.
As house Lyrandar is more involved with the Brelish side of the space race, would it be possible for house Orien as the other house involved with travel to be more involved with the Aundairians? The headquarter of the house is in Aundair. This could also increase the rivalry between Lyrandar and Orien.
Another option for Orien could be to support one of the other space ships, based on the houses research of teleportation options. A teleportation driven spelljamming device.
This is exactly what I presented in this article; my first version of the Dragonhawk Initiative was driven by teleportation. I specifically chose not to include it here because I’m not looking for a viable alternative to a spaceship; I want there to be space battles and ships passing through Shavaran Bloodstorms. I considered the idea that it would be more about them setting up teleportation circles to supply outposts, but to some degree my concern is that this would undermine the importance of space travel and give the nation using them too much of an advantage.
So essentially, it’s POSSIBLE, certainly. But it’s not what I personally want to do for this campaign.
Alright, for the « Eberron is connected to the wider multiverse » school of thought, here is how I envision things :
According to Fizban’s Treasury of Dragons there where a First World populated by primordial, deity-like dragons that waged a war against the gods of the Outer Planes (let us call them outer gods) which resulted in the destruction of the First World. I like to think that Siberys, Eberron and Khyber were survivors of this war, who developed an absolute hatred for the outer gods, and used the remnants of their power to craft the Siberspace/thirteen planes, with the following properties :
– Firstly and foremost, NO OUTER GOD CAN REACH, MANIFEST THEMSELVES, OF INFLUENCE THE SIBERSPACE IN ANY WAY. If an outer god tries to act, they would be drained of their power, potentially killing them (to give you an idea, look about the Source Wall in DC comics). This would imply to accept the idea that the gods in Eberron, if they exist, cannot manifest an avatar/identity/personality, ever.
– Secondly, the purpose of the 13 moons is to “anchor” the 13 planes to the Siberspace, so that there remain isolated from the Outer Planes of the Great Wheel.
– Thirdly, portals to Sigil (a no-gods city) and Spelljamming would be the only ways to leave the Siberspace. In previous editions, it was through the phlogliston, another ‘no-gods’ zone. In 5e, probably through the Astral plane (full of dead gods), and the colours pools/astral gates in Eberron are also of different colors than the rest of the Outer planes, adding another layer of difficulty.
As a conclusion, the progenitors dragons isolated their created world from the wider multiverse to prevent the outer gods from influencing their mortals, but while the world of Eberron CAN interact with other materials worlds, it can only be done by mortal races, and it is exponentially harder by design.
I am absolutely over the moon(s) with the great combination of my two favorite settings! On a ship with Lyrandar pilot, do you still need a spell jamming helm? Or do you need both–the pilot for controlling the elemental, the helmsman to navigate in wildspace?
Or do you need both–the pilot for controlling the elemental, the helmsman to navigate in wildspace?
My inclination would be to combine the two—that the Argosy has essentially adapted the elemental airship to space, so the one pilot performs both functions.
nooo not more motivation to work on writing up the moons as adventure locations, I’m neglecting too many projects already
You’re doing this too? I’ve been working on something similar in the Eberron server for about nine months. 😀 I’d love to hear about what you’ve been doing.
Virtually nothing because I went “hey, I should do that” two weeks ago and then got distracted by those other projects. I have a vague selection of ideas but no actual concrete stuff written down.
I saw your post about this very co stuff. Interestingly enough I’ve been doing the same thing. I’ve made the distinction of term “Moon” a hold over from dimensional settlers that occupied Eberron in ancient time. I’ve actually mapped a solar system where eberron is the middle planet so the other moons/planets which share much closer orbital tracs than we experience in our solar system. Anyway a meteor crashed onto the Eberron on long shadows and set some pretty nasty stuff in motion. Anyway they are about to start uncovering an expedition that has been shipping Gith machine parts to a manufacturer in Aundair who is building a spelljamer.
I know that normally the mournland as being like, 200 m tall, but what if it was actually infinite in height? What kind of interesting stuff a spacejamming ship could find there?
*normally hte mournland is treated as being like, 200 m tall,
Oh, and to add to that, what if new Cyre is starting to theorize the answers to the mournland are in syberspace? How would they try to enter the space race?
Assuming they’re luck, Perhaps Dannel left some secret blueprints, found in the ruins of metrol, and they are trying to use there? if so, what would these ships look like?
How would they try to enter the space race?
I suggest the idea that they could be late-game entrants. The main issue is that they simply don’t have the resources to run a space program; it’s not like New Cyre as presented has the facilities to compete with the broader industry of Breland. Which leaves a few possibilities…
1. A group of Cyrans—TOTALLY unrelated to Oargev, COMPLETELY independent, wink wink—hijack a spelljammer belonging to another nation.
2. Forget blueprints; Cyre was ALREADY WORKING ON SPACE TRAVEL BEFORE THE MOURNING and there are two working spelljammers in a secret hanger in the Mournland. The trick is sending a team that can find the hanger, secure it, and then launch the spelljammers — as well as hoping they haven’t been somehow corrupted by the Mournland.
There are some opportunities here for something like Operation Paperclip in real life – the US effort to snap up Nazi scientists after WWII to work for them. Finding surviving members of the Cyran space program to “recruit” (or kidnap) for another nation’s space program – or a player character BEING such a scientist who wants to avoid being kidnapped – is another potential hook.
The first option seems like a very cool first session, ngl.
Thanks keith!
One thing that Spelljammer seems to be bringing to the foreground of 5e is the silly side of D&D—plasmoids, space hamsters, dohwar, etc. To what extent would you want to bring in the sillier side of pulp while running Spelljammer in Eberron?
Eberron stands on the precipice of pulp and noir. The political intrigue I’ve described is more noir, but I think there’s still room to have a nation of Dohwar on the Dravago; I already suggested plasmoids on Zarantyr. Of course, I personally would start out with plasmoids being hilarious and then reveal that they are, in fact, horrifying.
Speaking of “anchors”:
I think of the kar’lassa as “anchors” of the moons. I like the idea that the moons themselves “anchor” the planes. I have the nodes of each moon (where they cross the ecliptic) rotate according to the coterminous cycles, similar to the 18.6 year nodal cycle of our IRL moon, Luna.
I like the idea that the moons themselves “anchor” the planes.
… Which is in keeping with the fact that the loss of Crya cut Dal Quor loose from the material.
I imagine the Cul’sir Dominion having used captured quori spirits to power their “spelljammer” ships!
Keith, do you have any thoughts on the hypothesis that the Cul’sir giants may have occupied Crya, weighed anchor (hoisting the kar’lassa of Dal Quor and stowing it on the moon, then setting out toward (and through) the crystal sphere of fixed stars?
Fantastic article, BTW!!!
Keith, do you have any thoughts on the hypothesis that the Cul’sir giants may have occupied Crya…
I think it sounds like something that would be printed in the Sharn Inquisitive as opposed to the Korranberg Chronicle… but if it’s the story you want to tell, go for it!
Those gnomes gnow too much!
Having the lost giants of Crya seems like a great way to incorporate the arcane/mercane of Spelljammer.
Hey Keith I have a question to throw on the pile. Are there any passageways or methods of crossing over from the manifest worlds to the planes themselves? Perhaps opened up by the giants prior to their disappearance.
It’s definitely possible; manifest zones can often serve as portals. But personally I don’t want it to be the primary focus of the moons; I’m more interested in having adventurers encounter things they wouldn’t find anywhere else, as opposed to having essentially the same adventure they could have in the Whitehorn Woods back home.
Keith, would you imagine Pylas Pyrial (if it isn’t already on Rhaan) would get involved with the Argosy via Zilargo? I’d written some blurbs for them on a similar theme to the fey magic stuff you have for the Dragonhawk Initiative, but now that the Initiative is being characterized as the Fey Space Guys I’m a bit worried about redundancy.
Keith, would you imagine Pylas Pyrial (if it isn’t already on Rhaan) would get involved with the Argosy via Zilargo?
Could *I* imagine it? No, not particularly. But that shouldn’t keep YOU from imagining it.
To me, the basic theme of Breland is pragmatic industry. Of the Five Nations, they have the least religion and the most crime. The basic principle of the Argosy is “How can we make a profit from this space thing?” None of that is in keeping with Pylas Pyrial, which is fundamentally driven by whimsy and joy. The Pyrial article says “The spire rejects those who come with greed in their hearts, and the Zil don’t spread word of its existence“; they just aren’t a match to the story I’m trying to tell here, which is about cold war ambition. By contrast, the Dragonhawk Initiative is working with the Mother of Invention, whose story is DEFINED by ambitious invention—albeit, ambition that doesn’t always end well! But essentially, when I think “whimsical romance” Breland is not the nation that comes to mind; whereas in wanting a nation that’s aligned with industry and profit, it is.
But again, that’s how *I* see Breland and Pyrial. If you’ve already written something for your campaign that links the two together, you tell the story you want to tell! What *I* do shouldn’t stop you from doing what *you* want to do.
Exploring Eberron says that “[Khyber Demiplanes] may have two or more portals, each leading to anywhere on the Material Plane.” Can they lead to one of the moons?
The moons are on the material plane, so it’s certainly POSSIBLE. However, as I mention elsewhere, I’m mainly interested in having adventures in space people couldn’t have at home. So finding a demiplane connection would be an exceptionally rare once-in-a-campaign sort of event—the amazing twist that gives the adventurers a chance to get home after their ship crashes on an extremely hostile moon—not something that would be turning up in every adventure.
What prevents easy teleportation across various celestial bodies? Consider, say, the D&D 5e rules for the Teleportation Circle and Teleport spells, or even a Plane Shift spell (used from another plane, with the intended destination of “X moon in the Material Plane”).
Good question. I’ve just added the answer to the main post:
The Ring of Siberys is suffused with arcane energy, which has many effects. It overloads divination magic… This field also blocks all forms of teleportation, preventing anyone from teleporting to or from the surface of Eberron, or teleporting beyond the Ring; you can’t teleport directly from Eberron to one of the moons. Short-distance teleportation effects can be used within the Ring itself, but cannot be used to leave it entirely. As with divination. this is a restriction that could be overcome in time as people study this effect and improve their magic. House Orien can’t set up a teleportation circle in the Ring TODAY, but given enough time they could develop a focus item that makes it possible.
That’s the practical answer. For the meta-answer, it’s because I don’t WANT travel to be that easy. In 3.5, teleportation circle was a 9th level spell, and the culture of the Five Nations was built on the idea that it was not an option; the best Orien could provide was Teleport, which had many limitations (look to page 11 of Secrets of Xen’drik for a discussion of this). As originally envisioned, Khorvaire isn’t supposed to have an easy, cheap network of teleportation circles; in particular, in 3.5 this is called out as a major difference between Khorvaire and Riedra, which DOES have a network of circles. 4th and 5th editions complicated things by making Teleportation Circles lower level magic, which threatens the need for the lightning rail or airship; why would you bother taking the lightning rail if it only costs 50 gp to circle-teleport between Wroat and Korth? With this in mind, Rising From The Last War asserts that Orien HAS circles, but it costs 2,500 gp to use one—implying though not explicitly stating that Orien’s system uses more expensive components than the standard spell… because, again, teleportation isn’t supposed to be part of everyday life in the Five Nations. This same principle applies to the space race. I don’t WANT people to be able to set up a teleportation circle on the moon and then be able to immediately bounce back and forth whenever they wish, because I want to run a campaign it which the exploration of the moons is difficult and dangerous. But as noted, the idea is that it could be possible in the future, but it will require an evolution of arcane science—because that’s always been a core idea of Eberron, that magic is a form of science. I don’t want it to be easy, but I’m fine with the idea that once Orien discovers they can’t teleport to the moons, they start feverishly working on a focus item that will allow them to punch through the interference of the Ring.
Plane Shift is a special case. The Ring blocks point to point teleportation, but it’s an obstacle within the material plane; I think that Plane Shift would allow you to teleport from one of the planes to any point in the material plane, on a moon or on Eberron, although I’d require the caster to be familiar with the location; in my campaign, someone can’t just say “Take me to Zarantyr!” if they’ve never been there. So this is a way to travel between Eberron and the moons—but it’s also a 7th level spell, which does place it beyond the capabilities of the Five Nations.
Is a Khyber demiplane considered part of Eberron for this point-to-point blocking?
What about divination from another plane? If the caster is unambiguously in another plane, can a divination gather information on one of the moons?
Is a Khyber demiplane considered part of Eberron for this point-to-point blocking?
A demiplane isn’t part of the material plane and I wouldn’t allow any teleportation that’s linked to being on the same plane to cross between demiplanes or between a demiplane and the material plane. In my campaign, this is why rakshasas have Plane Shift; they don’t usually go to OTHER planes, but it allows them to return to the heart demiplane of their overlord.
What about divination from another plane? If the caster is unambiguously in another plane, can a divination gather information on one of the moons?
The effect of the Ring itself mimics Nondetection, which says “The target can’t be targeted by any divination magic or perceived through magical scrying sensors.” In terms of the moons, sure, if you’re in another plane and using a form of divination that can operate across planes, then you could bypass this barrier and gather information on a moon. If I wanted to be picky about it I might say that this only works if you’re on the plane that’s connected to the moon in question.
Creating a Teleportation Circle takes time:
“You can create a permanent teleportation circle by casting this spell in the same location every day for one year. You need not use the circle to teleport when you cast the spell in this way.”
So, it would require a safe base on a moon or Siberys ring chunk in order to set up a destination circle.
Until then, only one-way travel back to an already established terrestrial (Eberronestrial?) Teleportation Circle would be possible. And this teleportation across the ring could be susceptible to interference equivalent to ‘Viewed Casually’ to ‘Viewed Once’ from the Teleport spell (depending on whether the destination was line-of-sight above or through the ring).
Excellent point; it’s not like you could instantly set up a teleportation circle to a Ring outpost.
But at the same time, a basic principle of Eberron is that arcane magic is a form of science, and one of the defining features of science is that it evolves. I like the idea that when we get into space, there are things don’t work the way we’re used to and we have to experiment and work to overcome those challenges. I like the idea that we need to figure out WHY we can’t teleport to or from the Ring and to find a way to overcome that interference; to me, that’s more of an Eberron story than to say that teleportation is an absolute, it’s as good as it will ever be, it works exactly the same on the Ring as it does in Sharn.
So you’re correct that even by the RAW there are challenges to teleportation. But as I said, I like the idea that getting divination and teleportation to work in the Ring would take work—and that these would be exactly the sorts of choices that players would have to decide in the interludes. Do you invest your resources in teleportation experiments or do you focus on building more ships?
I can absolutely see how the Argosy would proceed based on what you’ve presented here. It make sense for a more pragmatic nation/alliance to focus on using tried-and-true methods to expand into new uses, that’s the faster method to get the job done, even if it’s not as elegant a method as something new created.
I do admit though I’m a little inspired by the thought that Karnath, or some other group with expertise in necromancy, was working on a spelljammer that utilized the skeleton of a giant creature as foundation, animating it with necromancy to handle the majority of movement.
Or a group from the Twelve working on a construct ship utilizing parts salvaged from warforged colossi from the Mournland, that could be largely self-sufficient in wildspace.
Oooh, another idea, setting up a space train line to and from one of the larger asteroids in the Ring, or a new floating base near the ring, would be an amazing adventure, and might interest House Orien, as it would call upon their training in running the lightning rail!
Do the moons receive Siberys shard showers? Can they acquire Siberys dragonshards that way?
Do the moons receive Siberys shard showers? Can they acquire Siberys dragonshards that way?
Not in my campaign. The ring surrounds Eberron; the moons are beyond it. I’d make the Ring itself the primary source of siberys shards in space, and give the moons entirely unqiue magical resources.
Question about the relation of Siberspace and the Astral. The new Spelljammer book asserts “If you were to leave your home world and continue outward until you neared the edge of your Wildspace system, you would begin to see a faint, silvery haze. By traveling into this haze, you pass from Wildspace into the Astral Sea…Wildspace and the Astral Sea together comprise the Astral Plane”
– Source: Brandes Stoddard’s preview thread
Would you keep this as true? If so, how big is Siberspace?
Would you keep this as true?
I may change my mind when I read the book, but my inclination is no, I’d keep my depiction from Exploring Eberron. I still like the concept of The Truman Show moment when you point your vessel to deep space, set forth… and run into the wall at the edge of the system, in which the stars are just glittering stones. It emphasizes the idea that while we don’t know if there is any actual truth to the creation myth, Eberron is a constructed artifact—a metaphysical machine that was intentionally isolated from the rest of the multiverse. And with that in mind, I want the border between the Astral and the Material to be more significant than just flying in one direction for a very long time. In essence, I want it to be the difference between warp drive and impulse drive. Impulse is all you need to explore the moons and the Ring. But to venture beyond that will take an even more significant breakthrough in arcane science.
To me, the key is that the Wildspace/Astral idea here is designed to facilitate travel between the worlds of the multiverse. Which is great! But as I say here, that’s not what I want to do in this campaign, so I’d stick with localized interpretation that keeps Eberron isolated from Krynn or Toril. Figuring out how to pierce the barrier between the material and the astral would be a dramatic part of the final phase of the campaign—and finding out how to travel from Eberron’s astral to a different wildspace system would likely be the endgame moment, as the adventurers disappear into the ultimate unknown.
So I agree that Sol Udar is keeping the Mror busy, but the Earth’s first three space-faring nations all did so while conducting at least one war. There just have to be some iconoclast clans and individuals, seeking bold opportunities above.
-As the highest active volcano north of equatorial Xen’drik, can the Fist of Onatar provide enough starting altitude & elemental/manifest zone launching power? Do you see the location as more likely to be leased or violently appropriated?
-Will the draconic scholar known only by the nom de plume, ‘Fernian Bovine’ finally acknowledge authorship of a thesis claiming proof the Jhorash’tar orcs are escaped slave descendants from the neogi slaver fleet responsible for the complete depopulation of Noldrun? Furthermore, could these refugees be persuaded to reveal their secret knowledge of several small spelljammer engines, allow them to be dug up, reconstructed, and used to mount a rescue of the lost clan?
-Because the products and the techniques will be critical in keeping ship crews alive in the rigors of space and hostile moon manifest worlds, which nations are contracting with Soldorak, Soranath, & Narathun for fleshcrafting?
-If space-race is the theme, then The Right Stuff is the first game session! What sort of challenges would you have players create/overcome in qualifying for a ship’s crew? Do Karnns have to practice being resuscitated from heart failure? Do Aundairans have to take on a mission-specific geas from a fey before every launch?
-Astronauts, spacefarers, or Sibersailors?
If space-race is the theme, then The Right Stuff is the first game session!
I’m inclined to say that it’s the Session Zero, actually. I wouldn’t want to play out the tests unless there was an actual chance for failure, and I don’t want to spend that much time sorting out the characters before getting to the action. So I’m more inclined to make it a part of session zero and character conception—Why were you chosen? How did you handle (specific challenge)?
Looking to the Holds, I don’t really feel that I’d have a clan as a whole pursuing a space program. We haven’t presented Mror clans as, for example, pursuing the exploration of Xen’drik or opportunities in Q’barra, both of which are far easier to reach than the moons. Certainly, you could have bold individuals, just as I had Mror investors in my Q’barra and Threshold campaigns… but in both examples, those bold individuals are members of the Aurum, which after all began in the Holds. Again, that shouldn’t stop you from pursuing a more aggressive approach with the Holds in your campaign, but in mine I think you’d see a Soldorak or Narathun concordian funding an Aurum vessel.
Are there stars and constellations in siberspace? Would you have them as points for navigation or artifacts, locations, entities to interact with?
Per Exploring Eberron: “There are stars in the sky of Eberron, but they aren’t the anchors of distant solar systems. There are limits to the Material Plane, and the stars mark those limits; think of them as glittering points in a crystal sphere. The common constellations are figures of ancient dragons—Io, Tiamat, Chronepsis—though most people couldn’t actually say where these names come from. It’s generally assumed that they were handed down by one of the ancient kingdoms of Sarlona, or established by the ancestors of the Aereni—but in fact, the names are from a tradition spread by the sages of Argonnessen.”
I’ll note that these constellations are depicted in the original 3.5 Eberron Campaign Setting book.
The Dragon Gods are one of the few direct translations of dieties from the multiverse to Eberron.
What does the presence of their belief say about Siberspace’s connection to the d&d multiverse?
The Dragon Gods are one of the few direct translations of dieties from the multiverse to Eberron. What does the presence of their belief say about Siberspace’s connection to the d&d multiverse?
Eberron’s canonical connection to the multiverse is clearly called out on page 228 of Eberron: Rising From The Last War. “Eberron is part of the Great Wheel of the multiverse… At the same time, it is fundamentally apart from the rest of the Great Wheel, sealed off from the other planes even while it’s encircled by its own wheeling cosmology. Eberron’s unqiue station in the multiverse is an important aspect of the world… it is sheltered from the influences and machinations of gods and other powers elsewhere in the Great Wheel.”
Page 232 expands on this connection: “The three progenitor wyrms worked together to form Eberron and its planes as a new cosmic system in the depths of the etheral plane. The recreated the elves, orcs, dragons, and other races found throughout the multiverse, but allowed them to develop beyond the reach of Gruumsh, Corellon, Lolth, and other influences… in your campaign you might decide that the barrier formed by the Ring of Siberys is intact, and contact between Eberron and the worlds and planes beyond its cosmology is impossible. This is the default assumption of this book. On the other hand… it could be that the protection offered by the Ring of Siberys has begun to fail...” and that wider travel within the Multiverse is possible.
So even in the default version, Eberron IS part of the multiverse and it’s possible someone could slip out—as with Jeremy Crawford’s character V, or my playing a warforged from Eberron in an FR campaign. But the default is that such contact is rare and remarkable. Nothing about the myths of the Dragon Gods undermines this. As spelled out in Dragons of Eberron, the dragons believe that the Progenitors created reality, and that the Dragon Gods exist on a higher level of existence “that cannot be reached with any mortal magic“—like the Sovereigns, they can offer guidance (at least, the faithful BELIEVE they do, with no more evidence than the followers any other religion) but don’t physically appear. Which is in keeping with the basic idea; when the Progenitors created reality, they put the dragon god constellations in the sky and shared the stories of them. The dragon gods DO exist, but outside of the barrier, in the wider multiverse—and again, WITHIN Eberron, they serve the same role as the Sovereigns, just specifically for dragons.
Again, canonically, Eberron IS part of the multiverse; it’s just REALLY HARD TO REACH IT, unless a DM decides to change that.
Do autognomes have Ghulra?
No. They aren’t created using creation forges, and don’t all use the same basic systems. They’re sentient constructs, but they’re not warforged… which is why Merrix has been able to get away with creating them.
I’ve been thinking quite alot about Spelljammer in Eberron and am curious; If there is a Siberys Space, is there a Khyber space?
We know Khyber is an interconnected web of realities that acts as an interstitial space between all places in the greater Eberron cosmology.
So is it possible that Spelljammer could Access it to move at “Warp speed” like in star trek and star wars or move through the “Warp” like in event horizon or Warhammer 40,000. Engage “Khyber Speed” or maybe “Khyber Drive” then the vessel explodes foward through a tear in space, then passes through Khyber space, moving through Khyber for a short time would greatly reduce travel time but there is a cost- it would expose them to the raw eldritch taint of the realm.
I love this idea, what do you think?
Keith, I don’t truthfully have any questions, but I want to say that I’m blown away by this. The ideas and pitches as part of it leap off the page, begging to be run – if you’d ever have any interest in fleshing this out into a Guild release, it would be an incredibly fine book! I love the way you’ve made each nation’s spelljamming effort feel so distinct, especially with the unique crew roles available – the fey Warlock-diplomats and Paladin marine leader both rock. Keeping it as Eberron-centric in scope feels true to the setting in a really great way. Thank you for this!
I honestly can’t believe you even found a way to make Autognomes cool!
Oh, one final thought: the idea of the Karrn space program trying to mollify Seekers by making them a key part of their efforts is BRILLIANT! I’m a sucker for all things Karrnathi internal politics.
Thanks! I’m glad you like the idea.
Are there any other worlds in Siberspace orbiting Arrah?
Following.
Do you want there to be? My previous descriptions have said no, because I like to keep the focus on Eberron. If you assume that there’s some sort of truth to the creation myth, Eberron IS the center of the material plane; what role do these other planets play in that story? Ultimately, I feel that I have enough room with the twelve moons and the Ring—not to mention mysterious wildspace manifest zone phenomena, and the infinite space of the Astral—that I don’t really need other entire separate worlds; the moons effectively are different worlds, and there’s twelve to explore. But as noted in the new article, there’s no reason YOU have to be limited by that preference. If you want there to be more planets in the system, add what you need!